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Thread: Inline 6 on a 0411 pcm

  1. #1
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    Inline 6 on a 0411 pcm

    So, if I'm reading correctly, I can run a inline 6 on a 0411 pcm.
    I'll need to put a 3x crank trigger and a 1x cam signal.
    If I'm reading correctly, I can run port fuel injection and a distributor for ignition.
    Can anyone confirm this? Has anyone ever done this?
    I've read several posts where people said they were going to do this but they never finished the project or just never posted that they did.
    I'll be machining my own crank reluctor and maybe building a custom distributor. The pcm I'll be using is a 0411 with this bin.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  2. #2
    Super Moderator dave w's Avatar
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    The quick answer is yes, a 3x crank trigger and a 1x cam trigger will allow the I6 to be operated with the '0411.

    My idea for a SBC was to use the L31 distributor for both cam (CMP) and crank (CKP) signals. The pictures below are the design I cam up with.

    Basic engine math, 1x crank revolution = 2x cam revolutions, meaning for the SBC an 8x trigger wheel inside the distributor = 4x crank trigger. The I6 engine math is 3x crank = 6x cam.

    dave w

    Iso View.jpg

    CIMG2743.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by dave w View Post
    The quick answer is yes, a 3x crank trigger and a 1x cam trigger will allow the I6 to be operated with the '0411.

    My idea for a SBC was to use the L31 distributor for both cam (CMP) and crank (CKP) signals. The pictures below are the design I cam up with.

    Basic engine math, 1x crank revolution = 2x cam revolutions, meaning for the SBC an 8x trigger wheel inside the distributor = 4x crank trigger. The I6 engine math is 3x crank = 6x cam.

    dave w

    Iso View.jpg

    CIMG2743.jpg

    That's a very interesting idea. I may have to give that some thought.
    It may be easier that the crank reluctor I've been looking to make. And it would be in a self contained unit.

  4. #4
    Super Moderator dave w's Avatar
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    More pictures for more ideas?

    The cam signal trigger wheel is 175 degrees, not 180 degrees.

    IMG_0322.jpg

    IMG_0326.jpg

    IMG_0324.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by dave w View Post
    More pictures for more ideas?

    The cam signal trigger wheel is 175 degrees, not 180 degrees.

    IMG_0322.jpg

    IMG_0326.jpg

    IMG_0324.jpg

    Nice! So did you machine the housing?
    Why 175 deg?
    I was thinking I can put the cam trigger on the bottom of the mount plate and the crank trigger on the top.

    Would you happen to have a print for that???
    Last edited by Thorwon; 09-19-2021 at 01:04 AM.

  6. #6
    Super Moderator dave w's Avatar
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    I have access to very accurate measuring tools. I don't know why 175 degrees, but the one I measured was 174.96 degrees.

    What Inline 6 are you working with? Is there a factory distributor to leverage a dual trigger design. The SBC L31 was the distributor I leveraged because it has a CMP.

    BTW, it's very expensive to make a custom "One Off" dual trigger distributor.

    OBD2 is better than OBD1?

    OBD2 is more expensive than OBD1?

    dave w

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    I'm working with a 1988 Jeep 4.0 engine. There is a factory distributor that has a single trigger.
    That's why I said I might be able to put the other one on the bottom of the mount plate. I'm not sure there's room.
    I've been running a HEI big cap distributor for the last year. But something else has died in the system so I'm going to see if it'll run on a 0411.
    I'm a retired machinist so I have time to play with it. All it'll cost is the price of the parts. I have a lathe and mill with rotary. They're both small but in good shape.
    I already have a harness set up for the 0411. I'm still not sure what throttle body I'm going to use. The intake manifold has a weird 3 bolt pattern.
    So I'll probably just machine an adapter for it to a GM throttle body.

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    Super Moderator dave w's Avatar
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    My files are for the V8 Crank Trigger Wheel. Pictures below are the V6 Trigger Wheel and the V8 Trigger Wheel.

    The spacing for the V6 appears to be 60 degrees evenly spaced, or 60 degrees high / 60 degrees low. The spacing for the V8 appears to be 30 degrees high / 60 degrees low.

    V6 GM PART NUMBER 10230149
    V6 Crank Trigger Wheel GM Part Number 10230149.jpg

    V8 GM PART NUMBER 10190917
    V8 Crank Trigger Wheel GM Part Number 10190917.jpg

    dave w
    Last edited by dave w; 09-19-2021 at 05:50 PM.

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    I have both of those and that is what they measure with the deg wheel I have.

    I think the 6x trigger wheel I make for the distributor will need to be the same.

    I have also thought about just milling the harmonic balancer. It has a ridge around the front of it.
    4.0l jeep balancer.jpg

  10. #10
    Super Moderator dave w's Avatar
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    It's budget / skill / math decision. You got this.

    The dual trigger distributor option provides for a very clean installation. The dual trigger distributor will require 6x crank triggers evenly spaced and 1x cam trigger. The alignment or synchronization of CKP / CMP signals is the next challenge.

    Pictures below show alignment of the V8 24x crank trigger, V6 alignment similar.

    dave w

    DSCN3088.jpg

    DSCN5358.jpg

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    Dave, thanks for the info and words of encouragement.

    I'll let you know what I decide to go with.

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    Wouldn't the slight slop between the cam gear and distributor gear cause problem with the crank reluctor/sensor in a distributor? Those reluctors are usually very fixed to the crankshaft with no movement. I now it is small but still there is going to be some rocking between the gears.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2xls1 View Post
    Wouldn't the slight slop between the cam gear and distributor gear cause problem with the crank reluctor/sensor in a distributor? Those reluctors are usually very fixed to the crankshaft with no movement. I now it is small but still there is going to be some rocking between the gears.
    I'm not worried so much about the gear backlash as I am the slop in the timing chain.

    The backlash between the gears is probably not going to be any concern at all. Besides every distributor fired ignition system ever made has the same thing.

    But I'm not really worried too much about that. It's just an OLD engine that I'm going to play with.

    If this works I might Do the same thing to my 1987 Wrangler that has a 2.5L 4 banger in it.

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    Well there is injection timing as well since I don't think it will be running batch fire but it probably won't make much difference since I doubt you will care about misfire detection either.

  15. #15
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    2xls1 the total error should be less than 4 deg on the crank. and it really won't matter on this engine. We'll just have to wait and see how it runs

    But you're right I'm not going to worry about misfire detection. I'm not going to turn it off unless it becomes an issue.

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