Knock sensor and related parts

[doc_rock]

Also, injector flow rate is set to 30#. What # injectors are you using?

That may be a place to start.

Who knows where these injectors came from. Orange tops, "Python" stamped in the plastic, and no other markings anywhere on the injector that I can find.

Searching for a python 30lb injector brings up a bunch of orange ones - so maybe that's what they were, but I can't find anything about quality of them. Scares me to death all I see referenced for them is Damford.

[84Elky]

That may be a place to start.

Who knows where these injectors came from. Orange tops, "Python" stamped in the plastic, and no other markings anywhere on the injector that I can find.

Searching for a python 30lb injector brings up a bunch of orange ones - so maybe that's what they were, but I can't find anything about quality of them. Scares me to death all I see referenced for them is Damford.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but it's imperative you know details about the injectors, (and other things). A correct injector flow rate must be entered in the calibration because it affects fueling (VE table). And voltage offsets may also be important.

The attached file contains your custom chip calibration in a S_AUJP bin + ADX and XDF. I ran the bin as is in my car and all OK despite needing significant tuning. The only things I changed for you were (see TPro log file):
- Cylinder Volume from 713cc to 727cc (.030 over)
- Base Distributor Advance from 6 deg to 10 deg per your belief that is where distributor is set.
So if this bin does not run somewhat decently, there are other mechanical/electrical issues.

My recommendations:
- Make sure your IAC/TPS are properly set (Google for TPI instructions). Recommend 0.6v at 0% TPS
- Ensure your dist is set at 10 deg with bypass disconnected or change bin accordingly
- Increase idle spark from 20 to 21 or 22 deg and use those values from 400-800 RPM all kPas. Then at 1000 RPM, same value for 40-60 kPa. That makes spark always the same for idle. Smooth around 1000 area and transitions to off-idle.
-Despite AL heads, ensure you need that much spark above idle.
- User TPro difference tool and compare your new bin with the uncalibrated released S_AUJP bin. Pull into your bin any things that seem strange they were changed in your custom tune. Like:
---Switch 18 (0x018) - Bit 1 - Reset INT to 128 when in AE (Y/N)
---Spark Latency Correction (Should only be changed by someone on a dyno. Maybe the tuner copied that from some other tune. Should rarely be changed.)
---SPARK ADV, Temp. Correction .vs. Load .vs. Coolant Temp. Current settings providing too much spark below 133 deg. All entries should be 20.04 to match the coolant bias Scalar to yield 0 deg change
---PE Spark Adv. Is this really needed with all you now have?
---etc . . . . .

Bottom line, aside from spark and VE tables and a few Flags, can't assume use of anything different than the uncalibrated S_AUJP without a good reason.

And again, don't hot-rod it until tuned. See prior post with recommended procedure.

HTH, Elky

[doc_rock]

Please don't take this the wrong way, but it's imperative you know details about the injectors, (and other things). A correct injector flow rate must be entered in the calibration because it affects fueling (VE table). And voltage offsets may also be important.

The attached file contains your custom chip calibration in a S_AUJP bin + ADX and XDF. I ran the bin as is in my car and all OK despite needing significant tuning. The only things I changed for you were (see TPro log file):
- Cylinder Volume from 713cc to 727cc (.030 over)
- Base Distributor Advance from 6 deg to 10 deg per your belief that is where distributor is set.
So if this bin does not run somewhat decently, there are other mechanical/electrical issues.

My recommendations:
- Make sure your IAC/TPS are properly set (Google for TPI instructions). Recommend 0.6v at 0% TPS
- Ensure your dist is set at 10 deg with bypass disconnected or change bin accordingly
- Increase idle spark from 20 to 21 or 22 deg and use those values from 400-800 RPM all kPas. Then at 1000 RPM, same value for 40-60 kPa. That makes spark always the same for idle. Smooth around 1000 area and transitions to off-idle.
-Despite AL heads, ensure you need that much spark above idle.
- User TPro difference tool and compare your new bin with the uncalibrated released S_AUJP bin. Pull into your bin any things that seem strange they were changed in your custom tune. Like:
---Switch 18 (0x018) - Bit 1 - Reset INT to 128 when in AE (Y/N)
---Spark Latency Correction (Should only be changed by someone on a dyno. Maybe the tuner copied that from some other tune. Should rarely be changed.)
---SPARK ADV, Temp. Correction .vs. Load .vs. Coolant Temp. Current settings providing too much spark below 133 deg. All entries should be 20.04 to match the coolant bias Scalar to yield 0 deg change
---PE Spark Adv. Is this really needed with all you now have?
---etc . . . . .

Bottom line, aside from spark and VE tables and a few Flags, can't assume use of anything different than the uncalibrated S_AUJP without a good reason.

And again, don't hot-rod it until tuned. See prior post with recommended procedure.

HTH, Elky

Thanks, Elky. Sorry took so long, have family issues going on in Central FL needing tending to.
I do have a mechanical background, but it's old. Updraft carbs and magnetos, manual injection diesels and solid roller camshafts type of old. So essentially from heads down I understand it. Everything with a wire to it, in this context may as well be 100% new to me, so not going to offend me asking anything. I appreciate the help and if I get to the point where I've worn out my welcome - perhaps I'll have enough knowledge to not drown.

Loaded the BIN on a chip, and it runs fine - very similar to the old .BIN file from a sound/drive feel. It takes more spins to start it now, (that's something I've been paying attention to, and will troubleshoot later, but each .BIN I've loaded has had different characteristics when it fires up the car - I thought it fired up the car based on the cold start info on the original MEMCAL)

Done - Make sure your IAC/TPS are properly set (Google for TPI instructions). Recommend 0.6v at 0% TPS
Done - Ensure your dist is set at 10 deg with bypass disconnected or change bin accordingly
Don't know how - yet. - Increase idle spark from 20 to 21 or 22 deg and use those values from 400-800 RPM all kPas. Then at 1000 RPM, same value for 40-60 kPa. That makes spark always the same for idle. Smooth around 1000 area and transitions to off-idle.
Not sure I understand this. Is this in reference the above sentence?-Despite AL heads, ensure you need that much spark above idle.


- User TPro difference tool and compare your new bin with the uncalibrated released S_AUJP bin. Pull into your bin any things that seem strange they were changed in your custom tune. Like:
What does this do?---Switch 18 (0x018) - Bit 1 - Reset INT to 128 when in AE (Y/N)
What should this be?---Spark Latency Correction (Should only be changed by someone on a dyno. Maybe the tuner copied that from some other tune. Should rarely be changed.)
Does this indicate a need for a lower thermostat, or incompetence in original coding of the .BIN?---SPARK ADV, Temp. Correction .vs. Load .vs. Coolant Temp. Current settings providing too much spark below 133 deg. All entries should be 20.04 to match the coolant bias Scalar to yield 0 deg change
I am unsure. What modifications would necessitate a PE Spark advance? Is this primarily for pressurized applications? ---PE Spark Adv. Is this really needed with all you now have?
---etc . . . . .

[84Elky]

I do have a mechanical background, but it's old. Updraft carbs and magnetos, manual injection diesels and solid roller camshafts type of old. So essentially from heads down I understand it. Everything with a wire to it, in this context may as well be 100% new to me, so not going to offend me asking anything.

Understand. Similar background, but understanding how to tune is absolutely essential with other than a stock engine. Might go here and browse:
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/diy-...uide-book.html

Done - Make sure your IAC/TPS are properly set (Google for TPI instructions). Recommend 0.6v at 0% TPS

Just FYI, your log indicates 0% TPS = 0.69v initially. But then later at 0%, voltage is either 0.69v or 0.71v. This should not occur. Possibly loose connection or not firmly affixed to throttle body. Know that anything >= 0.78v is considered to be a "NOT idle state" and will cause problems with how the code deals with things.

Don't know how - yet. - Increase idle spark from 20 to 21 or 22 deg and use those values from 400-800 RPM all kPas. Then at 1000 RPM, same value for 40-60 kPa. That makes spark always the same for idle. Smooth around 1000 area and transitions to off-idle.
Not sure I understand this. Is this in reference the above sentence?-Despite AL heads, ensure you need that much spark above idle.

Something like this with your spark values. Don't worry about the spark ramp from 800 to 1000 RPM:
Spark Table.GIF

- User TPro difference tool and compare your new bin with the uncalibrated released S_AUJP bin. Pull into your bin any things that seem strange they were changed in your custom tune. Like: What does this do? Switch 18 (0x018) - Bit 1 - Reset INT to 128 when in AE (Y/N)

Disallows INT to be adjusted with the addition of fuel when in Acceleration Enrichment (AE). GM Factory and best setting.

What should this be?---Spark Latency Correction (Should only be changed by someone on a dyno. Maybe the tuner copied that from some other tune. Should rarely be changed.)

Use Factory values from the bin I sent: S_AUJP v6-28 ++AS RELEASED-NOT CALIBRATED++.BIN. Pull into your bin using TPro difference tool.

Does this indicate a need for a lower thermostat, or incompetence in original coding of the .BIN?---SPARK ADV, Temp. Correction .vs. Load .vs. Coolant Temp. Current settings providing too much spark below 133 deg. All entries should be 20.04 to match the coolant bias Scalar to yield 0 deg change. I am unsure.

Not related to thermostat. It's a method GM used to add/subtract spark at given temperatures and kPas. Set all values =20.04 in the 2 items below and there will be no effect on spark. The difference between the Table and the Scalar is added/subtracted to commanded spark advance.
---Scalar: SPARK ADV, Coolant Based Bias
---Table: SPARK ADV, Temp. Correction .vs. Load .vs. Coolant Temp.

What modifications would necessitate a PE Spark advance? Is this primarily for pressurized applications? PE Spark Adv. Is this really needed with all you now have?

GM used this increase spark while in Power Enrichment, likely because their fueling settings were pig rich and the extra advance was needed. Generally best to not use it and set all values =0. Properly configured, the main spark tables will provide the required advance.


A few other observations:
---Log indicates o2 sensor not connected. All data ~=450mv. Thus never in closed loop (CL), except at log sample 1912 when an errant reported mv=186 occurs outside 199mv and 699mv range (must be outside range for sensor to be declared active). Must have proper NBo2 voltage to ECM for CL, or will have to tune with WBo2 AFR or lambda because INT and BLM will always =128. Must correct this before proceeding with tuning (See attached Excel file).
---Was the car always in gear when idling? If not, trans wiring not correct because never show being in P/N. It is automatic, right?
---Regarding injectors. They appear to be 30# from log. But FYI, your engine likely only needs 24#. Leave the Flow rate constant at 30#/hr, but the VE tables will likely required major adjustment once you can log with the o2 sensor connected .

When you post another log after o2 fix, please also post your bin.

HTH, Elky

[doc_rock]

Hven't forgot, sorry for the delay. Ordered a new O2, but turns out the wiring for the o2 is all screwed up, so I'm having to pull apart the harness and trace it back as far as I can to get to good copper and splice back into it.
THey also powered the heated O2 off of a fuel pump line with a ghost tap - which makes me crazy.

[doc_rock]

A few other observations:
---Log indicates o2 sensor not connected. All data ~=450mv. Thus never in closed loop (CL), except at log sample 1912 when an errant reported mv=186 occurs outside 199mv and 699mv range (must be outside range for sensor to be declared active). Must have proper NBo2 voltage to ECM for CL, or will have to tune with WBo2 AFR or lambda because INT and BLM will always =128. Must correct this before proceeding with tuning (See attached Excel file).
---Was the car always in gear when idling? If not, trans wiring not correct because never show being in P/N. It is automatic, right?
---Regarding injectors. They appear to be 30# from log. But FYI, your engine likely only needs 24#. Leave the Flow rate constant at 30#/hr, but the VE tables will likely required major adjustment once you can log with the o2 sensor connected .

When you post another log after o2 fix, please also post your bin.

HTH, Elky

ok. back, maybe now i can focus on learning this thing.

Got the new o2 sensor in and wired, and it appears to be working. I'm getting readings from it now, and it's not throwing an SES light anymore.

It is a manual transmission now, with a Dakota digital speedo corrector installed, which is why i get all the weird flutterings at idle. i've reconnected all the wires, ran them down opposite parts of the car, run the ground directly to the body at the box, and still get the flutter - probably going to have to figure out what resistor needs to be soldered in to stop the flutter if it's required.

heres a current log and the .bin

[doc_rock]

When you post another log after o2 fix, please also post your bin.

HTH, Elky

o2 fixed, some of the parameters pulled from S_AUJP to this bin.