GM oval fuel pump relay terminals/components/tools?

[dave w]

I purchased some of my wiring tools from White Products: http://www.whiteproducts.com/cetools.shtml

I highly recommend the T-18 Terminal and Seal Crimper Tool!dave w

[dyeager535]

I was looking at that one It looks to me like even if not specifically designed for some other type connectors (not sure exactly what else I may crimp, but...) it might be applicable to other crimps if one were careful.

[kunsan1987]

try the dorman catalog on pages 18-22


http://www.dormanproducts.com/flipbo...log/index.html

[dyeager535]

Surprising amount from Dorman too, but I shouldn't be surprised, they've got a pretty extensive catalog. Thanks!

[JeepsAndGuns]

I purchased some of my wiring tools from White Products: http://www.whiteproducts.com/cetools.shtml

I highly recommend the T-18 Terminal and Seal Crimper Tool!dave w

I just ordered a pair of crimpers like the t-11 in the above link. We have a pair just like them at work, they do a good job. I also ordered a assortment of weatherpack terminals too. Bought everything from amazon.

[pmkls1]

I haven't looked around much other than on the tool trucks, but a truely good set of crimpers is difficult to come by and absolutely imperative to wiring repairs. I obviously have access to good crimpers working at a GM dealer, but have searched for some of my own for a few reasons. The most important feature to look for is an articulating jaw with a compount joint rather than a single simple hinged joint like a pair of pliers or scissors use. I recently got a set of crimpers with quick change inserts that will crimp weatherpack, standard, coax, and even 8mm spark plug terminals. BUT they have a simple hinge and still don't make the quality of crimp needed for a professional result. When I ordered them I was under the impression that they were what I was looking for. They are still an excellent set of crimpers and I use them quite often.

I NEVER reuse any terminal when performing wiring repairs because I am typically repairing problems due to poor terminal tension that usually cannot be detected without a proper probe. The correct terminals for most applications you will see on GM vehicles up through the late '90's can be found easily and cheaply and I believe that Dave W posted a link to a good site. I will reuse pigtails in a pinch and will normally just replace connectors with new pigtails if the wiring is in good shape, but the best method is to run new high quality wire using new terminals. The connector body and seal are a replace as-needed item. Another important step is to lightly solder terminals after crimping and I believe this is applicable to most terminals GM uses EXCEPT for the late-model micro .64 terminals which should be avoided at all costs anyway and aren't found in older vehicles. It is also recommended to apply a light dab of dielectric grease to any connector before reassembly to avoid terminal fretting.

[dyeager535]

This is SOMEWHAT pertinent, I hope people are still reading, as I know some of you have test benches.

Does anyone have any idea to A) what this style relay is rated for and B) what the entire injection system draws for ignition 12V while running? I know there will be some variation, but I am working on re-wiring my setup, and realized I'd run pretty much everything off the fuse panel accessory taps. All of those circuits are on 30 amp breakers, yet the fuses for the injection stuff are mostly 10 or 20 amp, which easily exceed the 30 amp breaker rating, yet I've never tripped it.

I would not be surprised to see that GM had a very large safety margin, but I don't want to start using those relays if they aren't rated to handle the load. I'm going to use an ignition hot to trigger the relay, which will then feed a bus on a separate fuse panel. Instead of running 5 separate wires all the way across the truck to feed things like the injectors, O2 sensor, etc. I will be able to run one long wire from the existing fuse panel, and run much shorter wires from the separate fuse panel to the items that need powered. The combined fuse rating will be somewhere along the lines of 50 amps for the ignition switched.

I now realize why the later vehicles are running relay/fuse centers underhood. I could use something like that, but the oval relays seem to hold up really well to water and mud, and if I use all the same ones, I only need to carry one spare, if that.

[dave w]

This is SOMEWHAT pertinent, I hope people are still reading, as I know some of you have test benches.

Does anyone have any idea to A) what this style relay is rated for and B) what the entire injection system draws for ignition 12V while running? I know there will be some variation, but I am working on re-wiring my setup, and realized I'd run pretty much everything off the fuse panel accessory taps. All of those circuits are on 30 amp breakers, yet the fuses for the injection stuff are mostly 10 or 20 amp, which easily exceed the 30 amp breaker rating, yet I've never tripped it.

I would not be surprised to see that GM had a very large safety margin, but I don't want to start using those relays if they aren't rated to handle the load. I'm going to use an ignition hot to trigger the relay, which will then feed a bus on a separate fuse panel. Instead of running 5 separate wires all the way across the truck to feed things like the injectors, O2 sensor, etc. I will be able to run one long wire from the existing fuse panel, and run much shorter wires from the separate fuse panel to the items that need powered. The combined fuse rating will be somewhere along the lines of 50 amps for the ignition switched.

I now realize why the later vehicles are running relay/fuse centers underhood. I could use something like that, but the oval relays seem to hold up really well to water and mud, and if I use all the same ones, I only need to carry one spare, if that.

Standard Motor Products rates their fuel pump relay (RY109) at 30 AMPs.

On my engine test stand, I've operated a complete TPI system with a single 15 AMP fuse for all ignition "ON / Start" circuits.

dave w

[dyeager535]

I appreciate that. I wasn't particularly clear in my previous post, what I meant was that all ignition switched circuits on the injection side are run off of a single 30A breaker, so I'm really unsure of why the fuses are rated at what they are...you have run everything on a 15A fuse, mine on 30A breaker, I can't see any reason why they didn't use a much smaller fuse, such as 5A.

I think I'll be safe then doing what I planned. Probably use a 10ga wire from the battery to relay.

Other option is to use an even larger wire straight to a battery 12V bus bar/junction block near my "relay/fuse center", and use that to power everything short of the fans, to include the ECM which will also probably end up in the same area.

Dave, what kind of intake air temps did/do you see on that setup in your picture? I was curious since I'm running a "cold air" setup I put together, and noted my IAT was about 101* on short duration cruises while tuning. Idle IAT was around 118*. Can't remember ambient temp, it wasn't super hot of course. Will have to re-think my intake routing when I go MAP.

[EagleMark]

My LT1 was pretty close to ambient temps when cruising, but went through the roof sitting still.

[dave w]

Probably use a 10ga wire from the battery to relay.

Other option is to use an even larger wire straight to a battery 12V bus bar/junction block near my "relay/fuse center", and use that to power everything short of the fans, to include the ECM which will also probably end up in the same area.

Dave, what kind of intake air temps did/do you see on that setup in your picture? I was curious since I'm running a "cold air" setup I put together, and noted my IAT was about 101* on short duration cruises while tuning. Idle IAT was around 118*. Can't remember ambient temp, it wasn't super hot of course. Will have to re-think my intake routing when I go MAP.

The factory uses 16 AWG for the battery power to the Fuel Pump Relay. I think 12 AWG would more than enough overkill to supply battery "+" the Fuel Pump Relay! The "+" wire to the Fuel Pump has a 15 AMP fuse for the engine in the above link. I used a factory "Fuseable Link" (12 AWG) to supply battery "+" to the Fuel Pump Relay, Computer / ECM and the Alternator (Bat terminal) for the engine in the above link (similar to the way the factory supplies battery "+" the service items previously listed).

I don't have the data logs for the test engine, so I can't answer the MAT temperature question. I think the test stand MAT data would not be very accurate, because the engine was not in a vehicle.

dave w