1st idle run with 1227747 ecm and modded bin.

**Fast355** · 04-11-2013

Originally Posted by EagleMark

Yup, no hex involved, just follow directions. Even easier is the new Patch.

We will have to check MPG and ? Not sure how it responds or what adjustments need to be made for Async.... When you get to playing start a new bin with ADSU, it's a Sync bin and runs better in everything I've tried.

Synch BIN files WILL NOT run a 60° V6.......They require an Asynch on BIN. Due to the firing order and intake pairing you will have two very lean cylinders with a synch bin.

**damanx** · 04-11-2013

Originally Posted by Fast355

Synch BIN files WILL NOT run a 60° V6.......They require an Asynch on BIN. Due to the firing order and intake pairing you will have two very lean cylinders with a synch bin.

I am intrigued by this.

Is there documentation available that discusses the operation of the rest of the ecm outside of the proms? Might be easier to figure that out by opening up an ecm and using the available schematics, probe as the engine is running.

The reason I am curious is that I know the stock intake, as well as the edelbrock intake I am using separates the intakes of the odd and even cylinders into two groups, obviously, 1 injector feeding 1,3,5 and the other feeding 2,4,6.

I will have to find it, but out of curiosity I made a chart using the spare 3.4 v6 60 block I have to run all the pistons through the 4 strokes. If I recall, there was always one piston on the intake stroke. Now, if this is correct, it would seem to me that both injectors firing at the same time would lead for a more rich condition. But this I am assuming is if the injectors were being fired once for each time the distributor sends a pulse regardless of what any of the piston strokes are. Alternatively, if in the asynch mode, there is obviously some division going on I am guessing.

One sure way to find out would be to put a dso on the injector leads and run each bin to see. Then probe the chips in the ecm between both bins and compare.

I could also be talking out of my butt, so feel free to say so if I am.

On a side note, learning this stuff, while having much more of a learning curve than slapping a carburetor on, is way more fun for me.

**EagleMark** · 04-11-2013

Originally Posted by damanx

I am intrigued by this.

Is there documentation available that discusses the operation of the rest of the ecm outside of the proms? Might be easier to figure that out by opening up an ecm and using the available schematics, probe as the engine is running.

The reason I am curious is that I know the stock intake, as well as the edelbrock intake I am using separates the intakes of the odd and even cylinders into two groups, obviously, 1 injector feeding 1,3,5 and the other feeding 2,4,6.

I will have to find it, but out of curiosity I made a chart using the spare 3.4 v6 60 block I have to run all the pistons through the 4 strokes. If I recall, there was always one piston on the intake stroke. Now, if this is correct, it would seem to me that both injectors firing at the same time would lead for a more rich condition. But this I am assuming is if the injectors were being fired once for each time the distributor sends a pulse regardless of what any of the piston strokes are. Alternatively, if in the asynch mode, there is obviously some division going on I am guessing.

One sure way to find out would be to put a dso on the injector leads and run each bin to see. Then probe the chips in the ecm between both bins and compare.

I could also be talking out of my butt, so feel free to say so if I am.

On a side note, learning this stuff, while having much more of a learning curve than slapping a carburetor on, is way more fun for me.

I've yet to see a guy take off as well as you have with the tuning end. But you obviously have some advanced computer skills that have come into play!

We do have a Sync vs Asnc thread and have discussed all this, even have some osiliscope patterns at:
http://www.gearhead-efi.com/Fuel-Inj...Asynch-fueling

From what Fast is saying it's the intake runners paired, which would make sense in fueling. Makes no sense in engine building especially with carb or TBI, I could see MPFI being ok there... but if you have separate runners and have already checked piston intake strokes I can't see why you would have to run Async.

I spent a lot of time with Async and Sync bins in my truck testing from when I found this issue on I6 Conversions a few years ago. There's no comparison on idle quality and low RPM, by my butt and by data, Sync wins!

**damanx** · 04-12-2013

I'm going to run the ASDU bin with the Spark Advance and BPW hacks, the BPW set to 144, EGR and EGR malf disabled.

Attached is the drive home with the same bin used as described in the 1st post.

**EagleMark** · 04-12-2013

I'm glad you posted that! It stirred up another memory from Async bins besides idle. If I'm remembering right... they all do the same thing as this data log. INT and BLM all over the place when ever you accelerate. After you reach a steady speed they finally come together and settle to straight lines. Trying to adjust VE from BLM never seemed to work right? Then when I got away from WinALDL and Datamaster and used TunerPRo I had the tools I needed to see why it never worked!

Can't wait to see a driving log with a Sync bin!

Idle was always a major concern because the majority of vehicles I tuned were off roaders and they all complained of idle issues! Now I remember the BLM issues as well...

**damanx** · 04-12-2013

Before I edit the tables, I am going to try this modded ASDU bin, unless you recommend otherwise.

**EagleMark** · 04-12-2013

I'd do one as is.

EDIT: In this case I would do one as is. I really want to see INT and BLM to compare to above data log. Normally I would do some VE smoothing... after your log I'll give you a hand using the data and smoothing VE. There's also things that should be turned off to help with better data for BLM tuning. EGR, DFCO, PE, Air... You have no Air, EGR is off, DFCO is not that bad and PE can be excluded from data...

**EagleMark** · 04-11-2013

Originally Posted by Fast355

Synch BIN files WILL NOT run a 60° V6.......They require an Asynch on BIN. Due to the firing order and intake pairing you will have two very lean cylinders with a synch bin.

Now we know why V6 bins are Async!

I can't recall working on one with this type intake? I know Async is a hard idle to tune if you ever get it right on V8, and absolutely forget getting an idle from a conversion I6 motor. We'll have to see what Onys 4.3L motor is as he went to Sync?